She’s an African-born French jazz singer famed for pop experimentalism, recording an album with Dizzy Gillespie’s drummer, being signed to the same label as junior UK jazz genius Jamie Cullum and touring with Afrocentric sax legend Archie Shepp. He’s a pianist/singer/trumpet player/composer/conductor/actor/writer/teacher/showman/comedian who has performed at Manhattan’s music monument Carnegie Hall, written film scores such as Le Courage D’Aimer (‘The Courage To Love’) and caused something of a stir when he appeared in front of the camera for the first time in a recent film by what might just be France’s most famous director.
Mina Agossi and Laurent Couson, who’ve been circling each other in the international jazz ring for more than a decade, are finally coming together this month for a Southeast Asia tour. Expect the unexpectable: the duo are ratcheting up the suspense factor by promising a high-end evening of one-off, never-heard-before, kind-of-made-up-on-the-spot jazz improv – organised by Phnom Penh’s very own jazz leviathan, Philippe Javelle – within the historic confines of the city’s most distinguished hotel. Nice. Laurent Couson put down his baton briefly to tell The Advisor about cornering Quincy Jones, having to play a Rachmaninov concerto live during a movie shoot and the one – slightly annoying – question he always gets asked by journalists in Asia (apart from this one).
So. You’re a pianist, singer, trumpet player, composer, conductor, actor, writer, teacher, showman and comedian. Did I forget anything? Your business cards must be enormous.
[Laughs] Something like that, yes! I don’t know. I try to do my best.
Take us back to the very beginning.
When I was very small, I was listening to classical music only. It’s hard to choose one favourite composer, but as far as I remember when I was a young child I was only quiet when I was listening to classical music. That was the only thing that could keep me quiet! So that’s why my parents believed this was maybe the way for me. It was, I think.
You’ve worked with some extraordinary names, not least Quincy Jones – one of the most influential jazz musicians of the 20th century, according to Time magazine.
I was very young when I did that. In fact I started my career as a composer and music arranger at Radio France. They gave me a lot of very interesting missions to arrange and conduct some great concerts in Paris. That’s how I met many big names. Amazing because I was only 22 years old, maybe, and I had to arrange this music and conduct the symphony orchestra for the concert Quincy Jones held in Paris for his birthday. It was a very quick but very intense experience.
Was it intimidating to find yourself working alongside a living legend?
Yeah, yeah, sure! Of course! I still get very nervous. What can I say? Yes! I remember that we talked together and I had the chance to get him to listen to my music for a while. I went to his room before the concert and asked him: ‘Please, please, can you listen to my music?’ I was listening to my music with Quincy Jones sitting near me and he said: ‘Wow! You’re a very talented young composer and I’m sure that you’re going to have a big career.’ He gave me the contact for one agent, his manager, but I never called him… [Laughs] I was too young, not ready for this!
You’ve said in previous interviews that you’re a classical musician first then you moved into jazz and have dabbled in pop as well, but there’s no difference between them: “The only important thing is making good music.”
Exactly! But I also believe that all music is not necessarily at the same level. It’s not the same work to compose a symphony as it is to compose a song, for example, but sometimes it’s more difficult to compose a song than it is a symphony, so…
Really?!
[Laughs] Yeah! It’s not really the same work because in jazz and in pop songs you have to work based on your feelings. In classical music, you need to have studied for many years beforehand. I was in a movie recently and all the journalists ask me all the time: ‘What is the difference between making music and being an actor?’ and I say: ‘The difference is quite simple. You can be an actor in one day, but you cannot play Rachmaninov’s concerto in one day.’
This is of course Ces Amours-La (‘What War May Bring’), by French director Claude Lelouch. Not only did you compose the score, you also made your acting debut playing a pianist and conductor caught up in World War II. Lelouch chose you because the character has to play Rachmaninov live during the shoot. Love the audition scene.
That was Rachmaninov’s second concerto – my biggest challenge in this movie.
What was it like, making the transition from composing movie scores to finding yourself in front of the camera?
For me, the most difficult thing in this movie was to play music! [Laughs] I have a lot of musical scenes and all of them are played live, so I was very nervous about that. I wasn’t nervous at all about playing my role. I was nervous about playing the Rachmaninov concerto: you have to be very fast for these things! But I was working with one of the best directors ever, so that made me feel comfortable. We just made a new movie this summer together and I’ve worked with him for 10 years now – we’ve made five films so far. Every time, it seems like it’s his first movie, but he’s made 50 already, which have won almost all the best prizes around the world. He’s France’s most famous director. I have wanted to be like him all my life, but I am not so strong. I am someone who’s very nervous; I try my best to hide it, but I’m not relaxed at all.
And Lelouch uses the same process as Italian film director Federico Fellini: you, as the composer, weren’t allowed to see the film before you wrote the score?
Yes! Sometimes you have to improvise, but it doesn’t matter whether you learn the script because the script will change in the morning [Laughs] – if you’re lucky, by more than an hour before shooting. It’s because you want to have this spontaneous feeling; spontaneous emotion. This technique has worked for many years. In this last movie this summer, some French stars were involved and they were very uncomfortable with that [Laughs].
The character you played wasn’t too far removed from yourself, in as much as he’s a composer, a musician. Did that make it an easy role to assume?
Yes, I was playing this role because it was close to me. After this movie, I had a lot of proposals to appear in other movies – of course, because Claude Lelouch brings you a lot of propositions. Sometimes, when I did the auditions, they would call me to play a policeman or a doctor. I was not comfortable at all with these. I played this role well because it’s closest to me, but I don’t want to become an actor at all.
Not even a little bit?
Actually, I prefer moving: that’s why I’m in Thailand, because we’re writing and producing a movie that’s going to shoot here next year. I’m going to be in this movie because I get to write exactly what I do [Laughs].If I get any other crazy propositions, like this Claude Lelouch movie, why not? Why not? But I won’t run after it. Everybody’s asking me if I’ll do a new movie, so OK: I’ll do a new movie, but I will do a new movie that I write. I don’t want to fail in my project, so I want to do something I can be sure about. I don’t want to make any mistake in choosing the next movie, because after this one everybody says: ‘Wow, this guy is very good.’ I don’t want, after another film, for them to say: ‘Oh no! Finally, he is a very bad actor.’
Romeos & Juliettes, the dance performance you scored, is exquisite.
This is my most successful show, because it’s been travelling around the world for five years already and it’s full everywhere; it’s a big, big success. Maybe because it’s a mix of classical and hip hop culture. I met a hip hop choreographer who wanted to do our own version of Romeo & Juliet. He said: ‘OK, I want the Montagues and Capulets to dance to hip hop.’ And I said: ‘OK, I want to do symphonic hip hop.’ So we tried to do something that had never existed before. I think the audience likes this kind of meeting between young hip hop dancers and classical music.
You could be forgiven for thinking the two are this far apart [stretches out arms], but they go together surprisingly well.
Yeah, yeah! We use a huge symphonic orchestra with this electronic hip hop rhythm and I think it matches very well. The most difficult thing is teaching a symphonic orchestra how to grove! [Laughs]
What do you listen to in your down time?
Let me see, I can take my iPhone [holds phone aloft]. There are very different things: Brazilian music; Bartok; Bernstein; Bob Marley; Duke Ellington; Earth, Wind and Fire. Everything, really…
Jazz music today: what sort of state is it in?
I miss it when jazz is not a party. I don’t like jazz musicians who listen only to themselves – I hate this. You have to be joyful. And I miss the kind of jazz that was made in the 1940s and ’50s, to entertain the audience: this is the most important thing. What is my favourite? I really love jazz from South America now, which is what I listen to most. I’ve performed in Brazil; there are musicians everywhere there, in every city. I was at a festival there earlier this year; they have a huge culture. I miss that in Asia sometimes. Here, some musicians lack even general culture; not only music.
When you’re writing for yourself rather than a film or show, what do you write about?
I’m going to sing my songs in Phnom Penh. I talk about very private stories. I write for my voice: I have a poor voice; I’m not a great singer. I prefer to speak about my stories with music. All my songs are about women.
That’s very French heterosexual male of you. What can we expect when you get here?
I know Cambodia very well: I come every year because I’m the patron of Paediatricians of the World. We made a film about the organisation two years ago. I have some little daughters in Cambodia that I take care of; I have many friends there. I had wanted to make the film for many years.
And you’re bringing Mina Agossi with you.
Mina had been following me for many years. She’s probably the most famous jazz singer in France; she wins all the jazz awards. She kept telling me: ‘We have to do something together!’ I was trying to think what, because we’re very different in the type of music we like and the way we play. We have the same bass player, Eric Jacquot, who has been playing with us for 15 years. Eric arranged this. He said: ‘Now let’s go on the road together and see what happens.’ So the only thing I can say to you tonight is that I don’t know what’s going to happen! [Laughs] Let’s see, because I really don’t know what’s going to happen!
You must have a hunch. Philippe said it wouldn’t be just French jazz and it could be – in his words – ‘interactive’. He’s already described you as a showman and comedian.
[Laughs] Sure, sure, sure, sure. I’m a showman, so everything could happen! Everything! Mina and I know each other’s songs, so we’re going to mix them up. That’s the good thing about being a jazz musician: we don’t need much rehearsal or thinking, just go on stage and see what happens. We’re having a gig in Thailand next week and I’ll know the answer next week, after that first concert… [More laughter]
Is there anything particularly pressing that I’ve forgotten to ask you?
In Asia, journalists always ask me if I have a girlfriend.
And what do you tell them, just in case our readers want to know?
My answer is: ‘I don’t know.’ [Laughs]